Embracing Lineage Imbalance

Idea:  Embrace the existing lineage imbalance.   Don't try to "Balance" them all out.  It's a roulette. 


Separate lineages into classes,  defined by colored borders,   and given different chances of rolling them by adding multiples of lower classes,  in addition to there simply being outright more of lower classes than higher classes.


Green:  Four entries (Meaning a Green lineage would have three results/clones of it,  increasing chances.) In addition to there simply being more Greens than Yellows.
Yellow: Three entries, in addition to there being more yellows than oranges.
Orange: Two entries, in addition to there being more orange than red.
Red: One entry (per lineage)


EXAMPLE (Colors only.  The lineages displayed may or may not fit into the color given to it for demonstration purposes):
  

  


Additionally I'd recommend a single Blank entry per class,  in which the player may come up with their own custom color/class-appropriate lineage.   A Red custom would still not be comparable to a Sacred lineage,  but a single golden lineage result could result in a Custom Lineage scroll.   Meanwhile there could be a simple silver one that lets you make a custom Red lineage (rather than having one custom per color).



Some basic suggested guides:

Green:  Lineages that provide some simple standard effect that doesn't scale.  Such as perhaps a spell that lets you change colors of things temporarily/chameleon yourself.
Yellow: Lineages that provide some combat effective utility such as the ability to teleport x meters every other post or so on,  or something like the Truth lineage's Anti-magic AoE.
Orange: Lineages that can be an obvious trump card / change how your combat style works / magic works.  Such as Archmage's ability to alter your magic's elemental properties.  Or a lineage that lets you reverse magical and physical effectiveness or offensive and defensive effectiveness.
Red: Lineages that have user-ranked effects, scaling as you grow.  Such as the ability to project a user-ranked fireball,  or control nearby water with user-ranked strength.  They might also grant a free ship, as ships have user-ranked functions.

Not really needed in my mind, but a good idea

Speed Demon Zack wrote:Not really needed in my mind, but a good idea

Nope, it isn't very needed.  But it's something that would spice up the lineages and make it a bit more amusing. 

The colored borders also fit really nicely and almost seem like something they'd have already but don't.

The nice colors might also make people feel more satisfied with the lineages they get in understanding precisely what they're getting and that everything is in an intended place.   Green lineage gets this,  Yellow gets that.   It's less likely someone might feel jipped because they got currently what would be a Green lineage,  while someone else got what would be a Red lineage,  since right now there isn't that classification/distinction between the two and as such they might feel that all lineages should be more on the same page / do similar things.


So,  it's not necessary.  But it could make things more comfortable and do something for morale if included someday and probably resolve a lot of the occasional discontent with lineages.

I agree, not necessarily needed but I like it. Some lineages are better than others, and harder to get, so people would be able to understand why some people have such good lineages. It is the luck of the draw after all.

I'm for dividing them but I think they should be divided in more than just colorful borders. Everyone knows strong weapons are worse then legendary, it isn't fair but it is fine because people spent more jewels to get the legendary one. I think the lineages should be divided into the weak, strong, legendary system then a dice is made for each rank. Then everyone who joins gets a free weak roll, and later they can save jewels to buy a roll from a higher ranked pool. Naturally you'd still only get 1 lineage though regardless of if they are different ranks, unlike weapons and such.

Then lineages do not have to be nerfed and there is more than luck deciding if you get a good lineage or not.

Everyone who already has a lineage that is above "weak," can keep it if they just pay the price of a lineage roll of the appropriate rank. If they do not have the money instantly on hand they can still keep the lineage they rolled but cannot use it until payed for. Alternatively they can just give it up and roll for a new weak lineage.

Kira whilst I like the concept that doesn't really make sense. Lineage is your bloodline. Doesn't really make sense for you to just get a stronger one.

We sell re-rolls anyway. Also sacred scrolls.

Most everyone ignores the lore of their lineage, unless custom, because 90% of the time they don't match your character's backstory at all.

Honestly they are already horrendously OOC, might as well make them good OOC.

I try to build my lineage into my history if I can. If not I ignore the lineage entirely

Kirahunter wrote:We sell re-rolls anyway. Also sacred scrolls.

Most everyone ignores the lore of their lineage, unless custom, because 90% of the time they don't match your character's backstory at all.

Honestly they are already horrendously OOC, might as well make them good OOC.

>90%

Speed Demon Zack wrote:I try  to build my lineage into my history if I can. If not I ignore the lineage entirely

That's mighty evasive of the issue at hand. Namely that lineages are in imbalance, and that there is a lot of room for improvement that requires little effort. Currently, there is little else to concentrate on considering the event is running smoothly and the dungeon system is still on ice.

So other than it "not being needed", is there any other reason we should not improve lineages to make it a more member-friendly system?

Lineages aren't meant to be balanced. They are meant to be completely random. That is how they were designed. Some people get good stuff, some people get bad stuff.

If we make it so 'weak' lineages are more common then it means more people are going to get a lineage that they hate because it doesn't benefit them as much. There is equal chance to get every lineage and that seems fairest in my eyes.

Some are useful all the time, some in only certain situations. I've seen people re-roll three or four times and still get one they aren't happy with.

It would be better perhaps for us to say that lineage should be rolled before a character so that people can use it as a basis for the character rather than saying 'this doesn't fit my character'.

Of all the systems on site i'd say the lineages are probably one of the things that if they need fixing then it should be ultra low priority. That is just my opinion though.

I'd like to point out most people shouldn't roll lineages first, because most people already know what kind of character they want to make. Not everyone wants to base their character around their lineage anyways, but some are game changers. It's whatever, I'm just saying.

Generally people tend to hate things that leave balance in the hands of dice. I can understand having some lineages stronger than others, that's not an issue. I think the issue is that some are so much more powerful (Monkey King's Descent, Strength of Hercules, Archmage's Seal, to name some). I think the ones largely considered to be the strongest should be nerfed a bit, and the weakest should be buffed a bit. Some imbalance is fine, but the issue is that some are ridiculously powerful, and generally custom lineages are just plain broken.

The reason i'm saying lineage first is because it could alter your character slightly.

As for nerfing/buffing stuff. We have done. These are weaker and stronger than they were in the past lol

A blend of the other suggestions with my own:

Green, Yellow, Orange, Red lineages could have separate dice...

One Lineage Dice that has 10 chances for Green,  8 chances for Yellow,  6 chances for Orange, and 4 chances for Red.   You then get to roll the colored dice.

A Silver card with 1 chance lets you make your own of any color or be consumed to allow the purchase of a Sacred Scroll for some 500,000 jewels rather than 20CC.

Shop items could allow specific rerolls of one color or another.

New starting players get three free rolls of the Lineage Dice (Determining color rolls) to start out with,  and they can choose between the three final results when making their character.



A lot can be done by stacking chances by inserting different results into the dice options multiple times.
Even the same lineage can come up in multiple forms that might include other starting bonuses in the form of little icons in the corners of the lineages indicating some bonus if that lineage gets rolled.  Such as a little silver sword icon granting a free legendary weapon to the starting player as an uncommon perk.

I always liked the current system. It adds a sense of Unknown to the world and the little imbalance it provides makes our FT world seem a little more real. So I'm against balancing the lineage system in any way.

In my opinion there aren't many ways to make the Lineage system better. The classification system will help a little, not a lot. I don't like these ideas of "Better" lineage rolls. It would dampen that Unknown element. Everyone should be offered the same chance no matter what. The Re-Roll is solely an option for lineages that just DO-NOT-WORK for your character, an absolute "No I cannot use this." And customs are just for rich donors who get whatever they want. (Trolol.)

So I like the original suggestion, but that is about as far as it should be taken IMO.

Honestly, I think the way to improve the lineage system would to weaken lineages altogether. Some can be more powerful than others, sure, that's fine, but none of them should be more powerful than any abilities or spells you can get through magic. Strength of Hercules or Brute of Fiore for instance give 200% and 300% strength buffs, respectively. No spell would be allowed to do that, so why can a randomly assigned thing? Randomly giving players massive advantages like that is less conducive to fun roleplay than allowing for OP magic.

This is all fine and dandy till you get screwed with Demonic Mask....

I have seen my linage in the form of a weak magical item.......

i don't think all of them should be equal, but this is ridiculous. I have people that get made for me and it's not even their linage....